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HP weirdness (N:O)


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Ishad Nha Ishad Nha

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 02:39 AM #1 HP weirdness (N:O)

Peculiarity of the original Nethergate, Dexterity does more for your hit points than either Strength or Endurance.
Health is 7 + (Sum of Weaponry skills) + Endurance*.
As it happens, 7 out of 9 Weaponry skills have base values derived from Str, Dex or End. These base values are boosted more by Dexterity than anything else.
*Note "Endurance" not "Endurance x level" or anything else like that.

Weaponry skills:
Melee Weapons (MW, Base level: (STR + DEX) / 4, Roman cost: 1, Celt Cost: 1)  
Spears (SP, Base level: (STR + DEX) / 4, Roman cost: 1, Celt Cost: 1)  
Javelins (JAV, Base level: DEX / 3, Roman cost: 1, Celt Cost: 3)  
Slings (SLI, Base level: DEX / 3, Roman cost: 3, Celt Cost: 1)  
Armor Use (ARM, Base level: DEX / 4, Roman cost: 1, Celt Cost: 3)  
Berserker (BRZ , Base level: 0, Roman cost: X, Celt Cost: 3)  
Hardiness (HRD, Base level: END / 3, Roman cost: 3, Celt Cost: 2)  
Defense (DEF, Base level: DEX / 3, Roman cost: 2, Celt Cost: 3)  
Roman Training (ROM, Base level: 0, Roman cost: 2, Celt Cost: X)

Str
Melee Weapons (MW, Base level: (STR + DEX) / 4, Roman cost: 1, Celt Cost: 1)  
Spears (SP, Base level: (STR + DEX) / 4, Roman cost: 1, Celt Cost: 1)  
12 Strength means 12/4 + 12/4 = 3 + 3 = 6

Dex
Melee Weapons (MW, Base level: (STR + DEX) / 4, Roman cost: 1, Celt Cost: 1)  
Spears (SP, Base level: (STR + DEX) / 4, Roman cost: 1, Celt Cost: 1)  
Javelins (JAV, Base level: DEX / 3, Roman cost: 1, Celt Cost: 3)  
Slings (SLI, Base level: DEX / 3, Roman cost: 3, Celt Cost: 1)  
Armor Use (ARM, Base level: DEX / 4, Roman cost: 1, Celt Cost: 3)  
Defense (DEF, Base level: DEX / 3, Roman cost: 2, Celt Cost: 3)  
12 Dexterity means 12/4 + 12/4 + 12/3 + 12/3 + 12/4 + 12/3 = 3 + 3 + 4 + 4 + 3 + 4 = 21
Then you have saved Skill Points on these weaponry skills.

End
Hardiness (HRD, Base level: END / 3, Roman cost: 3, Celt Cost: 2)  
12 Endurance = 12/3 = 4. Plus the 12 hp from the 12 Endurance, total is 16.

Base 0
Berserker (BRZ , Base level: 0, Roman cost: X, Celt Cost: 3)  
Roman Training (ROM, Base level: 0, Roman cost: 2, Celt Cost: X)

Edited by Ishad Nha, 13 June 2014 - 02:43 AM.


nikki. nikki.

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 07:03 AM #2 HP weirdness (N:O)

(I've moved this to a new thread, since it didn't really seem to make sense in its last location! :))

Pliant Giant Pliant Giant

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 01:23 PM #3 HP weirdness (N:O)

Yeah, this is well known.  Original Nethergate had all kinds of interesting stuff with the chains of ability scores that fed other ability scores that fed...
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Ishad Nha Ishad Nha

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 10:08 PM #4 HP weirdness (N:O)

Why this went out of fashion with Jeff I don't know.

Randomizer Randomizer

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 10:23 PM #5 HP weirdness (N:O)

It was also in the Exile series.  When Jeff switched to Avernum it started to go away.

I think it happened because some players took too much of an advantage to using the four stats to improve skills instead of going directly to skills.  An extreme example was TM's singleton Roman character that was immune to being hit.
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Pliant Giant Pliant Giant

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Posted 14 June 2014 - 03:05 AM #6 HP weirdness (N:O)

Huh?  It wasn't in the Exile series.
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Celtic Minstrel Celtic Minstrel

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Posted 14 June 2014 - 09:41 AM #7 HP weirdness (N:O)

I'm pretty sure it was in the first Avernum trilogy though...
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diclobcid diclobcid

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Posted 14 June 2014 - 11:08 AM #8 HP weirdness (N:O)

It was, but to a lesser extent. Nethergate was the peak of cascading skill effects.

—Alorael, who enjoyed it. He actually really likes Nethergate's non-leveling system even if it is very abusable.

Ishad Nha Ishad Nha

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Posted 22 June 2014 - 07:57 AM #9 HP weirdness (N:O)

I don't think it was all that abusable, the enemies were not pushovers.




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