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An Exile/Avernum art project... A little help?


Necris Omega

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I'm looking to do some Avernum/Exile based digital art, particularly around the weapons. Thing is, I can't find any good source of description that's not just either the history or mechanics of the items in question, and unfortunately all my saves are way past the point of being able to go back and find them manually.

 

Getting the original, original descriptions, IE Exile versions, would be even better, but that I know is a heck of a tall order. Nevermind any sort of game progress problems, I don't even have a system legacy enough on hand to even run the originals, and I know I'm hardly the only one.

 

That said, I'm starting with Demonslayer - the sword of swords when it comes to Avernum. All I can remember off the top of my head is that it's supposed to be of Damascus Steel, but that could be a faulty memory on my part.

 

If anyone has any of the physical description details on the blade of Karzoth, or any of the other great artifacts of Exile/Avernum, I'd be appreciative.

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"Damascus steel" seems like a strange description for a world in which there is no city of Damascus. Though it's an interesting question. As well as lacking Damascus, it seems unlikely that the Empire speaks English. So presumably everything we read about Exile/Avernum is translated, anyway. Some technique like the Damascus steel-making process could well exist in Avernum. So how should it be named? Is calling it 'Damascus steel' just the same kind of translation as using the English word 'sword' for Demonslayer?

 

The right answer is clearly not to think about all this so much. But somehow referring to a real-world city by name seems out of place in a fantasy world.

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"Damascus steel" seems like a strange description for a world in which there is no city of Damascus. Though it's an interesting question. As well as lacking Damascus, it seems unlikely that the Empire speaks English. So presumably everything we read about Exile/Avernum is translated, anyway. Some technique like the Damascus steel-making process could well exist in Avernum. So how should it be named? Is calling it 'Damascus steel' just the same kind of translation as using the English word 'sword' for Demonslayer?

 

The right answer is clearly not to think about all this so much. But somehow referring to a real-world city by name seems out of place in a fantasy world.

 

Very true - much like many games that have some varient of "Swiss cheese" yet absolutely no Switzerland. Senseless, sure, but how else are you going to get most people who aren't cheese enthusiasts to recognize that style of cheese? "Emmentaler" will go over the heads of most I'd wager.

 

Anyways, that part of the description always did stick with me as it's what first prompted me to look up what was so special about Damascus steel to begin with. I still freely admit I could be wrong about that, as we're talking the mid-90s here...

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"Damascus steel" seems like a strange description for a world in which there is no city of Damascus. Though it's an interesting question. As well as lacking Damascus, it seems unlikely that the Empire speaks English. So presumably everything we read about Exile/Avernum is translated, anyway. Some technique like the Damascus steel-making process could well exist in Avernum. So how should it be named? Is calling it 'Damascus steel' just the same kind of translation as using the English word 'sword' for Demonslayer?

 

The right answer is clearly not to think about all this so much. But somehow referring to a real-world city by name seems out of place in a fantasy world.

 

In the original Exile 1, a minor character was actually described as "Asian" in the text you got when you first started a conversation with them. At some point between then and A:EftP, I'm pretty sure Jeff realised how silly that was and changed it.

 

also hilarious historical fact: in ancient India, a process basically identical to Damascus steelmaking was known as "wootz"

 

Very true - much like many games that have some varient of "Swiss cheese" yet absolutely no Switzerland. Senseless, sure, but how else are you going to get most people who aren't cheese enthusiasts to recognize that style of cheese? "Emmentaler" will go over the heads of most I'd wager.

 

Emmental is also named after a place so it's not like that solves the core problem

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Actually, wootz steel was exported from India and probably delivered to Damascus, where it was used to make the famous swords. Wootz steel was good steel; Damascus had great swordsmiths and got the fame.

 

—Alorael, who can recommend the text dumps for all your descriptive needs. It has all the text you could want. Unfortunately, it's highly user unfriendly, and it doesn't look like Demonslayer ever gets a great description, although the pommel does.

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thanks! i found the passage i was thinking of in that text dump

 

You find a small Asian woman with waist-length hair. She seems to be mixing up some poison."Greetings. I'm Yong-Mi."

 

that's exile 1. now compare avernum 1:

 

You meet a small woman with close-cropped hair. She seems to be mixing up some poison.

 

sure enough, "Asian" is gone. apparently she got a haircut too for some reason

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grep'd the dump for damascus. This is in A2 and E2 (and it is indeed about Demonslayer).

 

This simple, long stone box rests on white marble. It is adorned only by the sun symbol of Avernum.

 

Inside, you find the unique artifact for which this well hidden complex was built. It's a greatsword in a long leather sheath. The handle is wrapped in leather and gold wire, and the bit of the blade you can see is Damascus steel.

 

It's not much of a description, but the distinctive appearance of Damascus steel should give you a good idea to draw from.

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Ah, I was right then! Damascus (styled) steel it is then.

 

Thank you Alorael - I'll see about tearing those apart to see if I can't pull more information out of them. It might not be much, but it's more than I've had to go on before I asked.

 

Worse comes to worse, maybe I'll put up an emulator to see if I can't get Exile off the ground.

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Wow. It's a hard choice, but I think I find Demonslayer more impressive. The level of detail in the hilt is so high, without being silly, that it really looks like a magic greatsword, not just a fancy one. Like a complex machine.

 

When you get finished with Avernum, actually, maybe you should turn to steampunk.

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Wow. It's a hard choice, but I think I find Demonslayer more impressive. The level of detail in the hilt is so high, without being silly, that it really looks like a magic greatsword, not just a fancy one. Like a complex machine.

 

When you get finished with Avernum, actually, maybe you should turn to steampunk.

I actually did about three different revisions on Demonslayer, reworking the Pommel, Hilt, and Blade about two times each before I got it to the point I settled on.

 

The Pommel sadly ended up muddied and undetailed at smaller sized (the originals are about 3x the size of what's posted) and the coloration got too yellowed. The design was solid enough to follow through with, though, so while I redid it, it was the quickest to redo.

The first revision of the Hilt was just beneath me, so it was completely thrown out and redone. Too simple, the texture was awful, and the cross-guard in particular was bad the first time around.

 

The blade I actually had the most trouble with - the shape was bad, and the texture was a real conundrum - Damascus steel was a must, but the weapon is also described as coated in runes. No matter WHAT the size, I couldn't use one without losing the detail of the other. Ultimately I compromised here, but it still bugs me to some extent.

 

As to Steampunk... I actually threw that idea around for the Fury Crossbow, which is my next target. I don't know if I'll go through with it (the last Steampunk crossbow I did was kinda a wash) but we'll see.

 

That said, I'm up for suggestions beyond the Fury Crossbow. I'd like to do Pachtar's Plate and the Alien Blade, but beyond that? There are still a ton of other iconic or even semi-iconic items from the Avernum/Exile series, and I'm thinking of perhaps tacking some of Geneforge's stuff as well, but like I've said all along description content for a lot of this yet eludes me.

 

 

Beyond that, though, to everyone else who've expressed their kind words, thank you all - responses like that are what keep me inspired to keep going. Demonslayer did take the most work between the two. The Black Halberd just sorta came together and flowed right the first time. While it does give me less to obsess over, dwell upon and regret, well.. while Avernum & Exile have permanently left me with a greater appreciation for the Halberd over just about any other spear/axe type weapon, like any fantasy pleb, I like swords.

 

Good draws. The Black Halberd looks like a much cooler version of the weapon used by your Nether Being.

... Someone actually remembers that graphic. Wow!

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It took me several revisions to get this one done - initially I started out in a fairly straightforward fashion, but realized that the angle needed to be something far more infuriatingly complicated. Half-way through I got a very half-baked idea that expanded it into even more complexity, so much so that the angles involved almost drove me to a full on abortion of the whole thing.

 

Me and my big ideas...

 

Anyways, I soldiered through, added my usual level of detail to obscure any of the glaring errors, and ultimately came up with this. I was considering going with an almost alien, wyrm like motiff in honor of the colossal monstrosities guarding the weapon, but I went with something I felt more resembled the game description of the bow itself. The design choices I made might be a bit controversial to some - I started with a very traditional Medieval Crossbow shelf, but then moved onto something more exotic. But, you'll have to decide for yourself.

 

Without further ado, I give you the Fury Crossbow

 

http://i.imgur.com/sQYQt.jpg

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The overall style looks great, but the way that the bow itself bends — those joints look too weak. It's hard to see the spine of the bow, so the bow looks as though it's just made of fragile-looking feathery things, lightly taped together. It makes the whole weapon look flimsy, I'm afraid. Can't you do something to beef up the look of that join, somehow, so that the thing looks strong and deadly instead of fragile?

 

It might even be enough just to make several layers of the wing-like units. That would make the bow look a lot stronger. Or perhaps just to put the wing-things underneath the spine of the bow, which is hard to see right now.

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Those are great. The alien blade is really alien-looking, but not to the point that it fails to look like a usable blade. The jade halberd is also really good, to me. Somehow the shape of the axehead looks as though it makes sense for a magic weapon made out of jade. The haft makes sense, too. Rather formal, like a staff of office.

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To explain the designs -

 

The Fury Crossbow and Jade Halberd are actually heavily Asian influenced. When I thought of the Fury Crossbow, I always think of the added speed benefit from Avernum. To me, this translated into a repeating crossbow, or a Chinese Chu-ko-nu. It still maintains a large European influence with the shape of the shelf, but is ultimately a hybrid of sorts.

 

The Jade Halberd is also Asian in influence, simply because I always equate Jade with the far east. Really, its as simple as that.

 

The Alien Blade? Eh, nothing really amazing stands out as an influence to me. It's not quite a flamberge, it's not quite a super-sized keris, it just... is. I tried to make the hilt something fittingly Alien, but I wrestled with the color scheme and I think it maybe got a little too... hi-techy. I was also considering having it coated with visible poison, but in the end, I took one look at it and could only think of Dr. Janosz Poha - "Why am I covered in goo?"

 

So I left it off. But... the Blade itself really did come out great - I wish I'd used the same texturing technique on Demonslayer now.

 

But, that said... what should my next installment be?

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The fury crossbow looks like it would hurt the user just to hold it. All those pointy ends everywhere. The Jade Halberd looks the best out of all that you have done so far to me. It looks delicate, but deadly.

 

I know I would like to see the Flaming Sword and Ice Sword. Those two are my favorite of all the weapons. You could also do the Xin(sp) Skull for giggles. Cannot wait to see your next interpretation of a weapon.

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I know I would like to see the Flaming Sword and Ice Sword. Those two are my favorite of all the weapons. You could also do the Xin(sp) Skull for giggles. Cannot wait to see your next interpretation of a weapon.

 

The Xian Skull doesn't have much in the means of interpretation from a design standpoint, and while I loved the Flaming, Icy, and even Oozing Swords, I believe at least the first two are described as normal looking weapons minus the magical effect.

 

That "normal looking" bit is what stops me, really. I don't do "normal", I do outrageously ostentatious with unreasonable amounts of decoration. It's why I don't plan to do the Band of Endless Magery - it's described as a simple gold band.

 

I've been throwing around the idea of Scrioth though - the flame spitting greatsword Mortax kept from the First Expedition. It may not have much in terms of a description to go off of, but it's at least fairly Exile centric.

 

Even though it's remarkably esoteric in comparison to some of the other items in the series, I mean.

 

Smite. Smite. Smite. :o

 

Yeah, that was on my potential to do list too actually. The original hammer version - As much as I loved Avernum, I miss the more diverse arsenal of Exile.

 

Beyond that... Hm...

 

There are a list of weapons I'll come up with just browsing my Avernum saves, but I'm still open to suggestions.

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Wow, all of these are incredibly beautiful. If I had to die, I think I wouldn't mind it so much at the end of one of these.

 

Is there any reason you have beyond the joy of creation and adding to your portfolio for this little project. I'm curious to know what, if anything, you will be doing with them.

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Wow, all of these are incredibly beautiful. If I had to die, I think I wouldn't mind it so much at the end of one of these.

 

Is there any reason you have beyond the joy of creation and adding to your portfolio for this little project. I'm curious to know what, if anything, you will be doing with them.

 

Why am I doing this? Simple - art has always been my passion, talent or no. Weapons are my specialty, and I've been a fan of Spiderweb's work for... well almost as long as one can possibly be a fan.

 

As the response to my work as thus far been mostly positive, and I'm not out of ideas just yet, I'll keep on going until one of the two changes.

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